The position adopted by Osborne,Alexander, Darling et.al was a political one; one of deliberately creating difficulties where none existed. It served it's purpose though and as a manufactured and contrived uncertainty it proved to be one of the most effective and ultimately, I think, decisive components of the project fear strategy. Whether if, in the event of a Yes vote this threat to poisoning the well would have actually been implemented is something which for now we can really only speculate.
Yes, that's true, and an unnamed Tory minister was said to opined at the time that they would, of course share currencies, as they did in the past with RoI and still do with various smaller countries.
It's true that they couldn't have stopped Scotland using the pound. Sweden couldn't have stopped us using the Krona, Canada couldnt have stopped us using the Canadian dollar.
But I suspect they could have made life difficult if they wanted to.
Of course they didn't talk that part of it up.
I think what Mr King is saying is that it shouldn't have been an issue.
It's not a perfect situation using someone else's currency (they control its value), but I guess it wouldn't have been a long term situation either.
It worked for Ireland, and it still works of Guernsey, Jersey, Man, Gibraltar, Malvinas, etc.
Exactly bjsalba, they could have screamed, cried and stamped their feet, but they could not have stopped Scotland from using sterling. Osborne and co would have been on the first plane to Edinburgh to make sure that we did, even temporarily. It was I believe one of our biggest bargaining chips and they new it.
Ireland etc being only one of many countries that have used the GBP.
Aden-The Federation of South Arabia Bahrain Australia Sudan Bahamas Fiji Hong Kong Cyprus Ghana Iceland India Eire Jamaica Nigeria New Zealand Singapore Trinidad and Tobago The Republic of South Africa
all the above used the GBP or a currency linked to it in the last 75 years.
Added to the Isle of Man, Jersey, Guernsey, Gibraltar, which print their own versions of pounds, but have entirely separate governments, following very different policies.
Strange that uniquely, a tie with Scotland would have been impossible.
I think, Jim, Zog was referring to my additions of Jersey, Guernsey and Man...etc.
True of course that they are small; also that they are tax havens, but it proves doesn't it, that you can still work with the pound, even though your economy is absolutely different.
Before the next referendum, we have to have this sorted.
It is probably true (as per bjsalba) that no-one could have stopped us.
But it still gives power and influence, power and influence I want to see destroyed, to the City of London. This entire country has been corrupted by a Tory Government and The City. Your previous articles about poverty do not resonate with either Tories or The City. They do resonate with your readership.
I want nothing to do with them.
I think that - come independece - our decent financial institutions will stick with us, and hell mend the rest!
Use of sterling seems to me a short term thing... as it was with all of the larger countries listed above by Anon.
The Euro is a non starter, I'd think. At l;east with the public, and definitely while some of the countries (who shouldn't have been in the € in the first place are in such a mess).
So we need a Scottish... something... Krona? Dollar? Whatever.
I favour the "Crown". It ties in with the Scandinavian Kroner/Krona and chimes with Scotland's history and current status as a kingdom. Even if we become a republic, there would be no need to change it.
Oh dear the snp wanted to have more than favorable terms when using the Queens pound if ( YA Didn't ) they had won a referendum organised and run by the snp which they still lost massively.
meanwhile as the Union supporters bend over backwards to carry out the snp demands . the snp spit venom and hate towards the Union and its supporters of which was proven to be a majority of Scots.
and for not being allowed use of a pound sterling a nation was lost
well that is wot the nats want to believe the truth is somewhat more complex still heigh ho ! Leave them to their delusions
Actually Nikos, the majority of "Scots" (those of us actually born here) voted YES in the referendum. "Scots" under 65y/o voted quite decisively YES.
Three groups voted overwhelmingly NO; the elderly, the English and EU nationals. The elderly voted NO largely because they were lied to about pensions; the English voted NO because they understandably wanted the status quo; EU nationals voted NO largely because they were lied to about EU membership guarantees.
Better Together cleverly concentrated on scaring the bejesus out of these minorities knowing full well the truth was not their friend. So they lied to them. Does it make you proud?
The Irish Free State, having fought a violent conflict to leave the British Empire was allowed to use Sterling. So why shouldn't we after having a democratic vote?
The Unionists got the result they wanted but only through threats and intimidation. They think we have lost, we have not lost. The Union is dying.
The position adopted by Osborne,Alexander, Darling et.al was a political one; one of deliberately creating difficulties where none existed. It served it's purpose though and as a manufactured and contrived uncertainty it proved to be one of the most effective and ultimately, I think, decisive components of the project fear strategy. Whether if, in the event of a Yes vote this threat to poisoning the well would have actually been implemented is something which for now we can really only speculate.
ReplyDeleteYes, that's true, and an unnamed Tory minister was said to opined at the time that they would, of course share currencies, as they did in the past with RoI and still do with various smaller countries.
DeleteMr King is being disingenuous.
ReplyDeleteThe Pound is an internationally traded currency.
As such there was no way the UK government could have prevented Scotland using it for as long as we wanted to.
Of course, given their attitude, how long we would have wanted to do so is quite another question.
DeleteIt's true that they couldn't have stopped Scotland using the pound. Sweden couldn't have stopped us using the Krona, Canada couldnt have stopped us using the Canadian dollar.
But I suspect they could have made life difficult if they wanted to.
Of course they didn't talk that part of it up.
I think what Mr King is saying is that it shouldn't have been an issue.
It's not a perfect situation using someone else's currency (they control its value), but I guess it wouldn't have been a long term situation either.
It worked for Ireland, and it still works of Guernsey, Jersey, Man, Gibraltar, Malvinas, etc.
Exactly bjsalba, they could have screamed, cried and stamped their feet, but they could not have stopped Scotland from using sterling. Osborne and co would have been on the first plane to Edinburgh to make sure that we did, even temporarily. It was I believe one of our biggest bargaining chips and they new it.
DeleteYes, they probably would have.
DeleteIreland etc being only one of many countries that have used the GBP.
ReplyDeleteAden-The Federation of South Arabia
Bahrain
Australia
Sudan
Bahamas
Fiji
Hong Kong
Cyprus
Ghana
Iceland
India
Eire
Jamaica
Nigeria
New Zealand
Singapore
Trinidad and Tobago
The Republic of South Africa
all the above used the GBP or a currency linked to it in the last 75 years.
Thanks Anon.
DeleteAdded to the Isle of Man, Jersey, Guernsey, Gibraltar, which print their own versions of pounds, but have entirely separate governments, following very different policies.
Strange that uniquely, a tie with Scotland would have been impossible.
Tris, they are also small and are tax havens.
Deletezog
Eh? Zog, New Zealand, South Africa, Australia; small tax havens pull the other one, it's got a bullshit detector too.
DeleteI think, Jim, Zog was referring to my additions of Jersey, Guernsey and Man...etc.
DeleteTrue of course that they are small; also that they are tax havens, but it proves doesn't it, that you can still work with the pound, even though your economy is absolutely different.
Right enough, working on a small screen here, apologies to Zog.
DeleteAnd true enough, size doesn't matter, so they say.
Before the next referendum, we have to have this sorted.
ReplyDeleteIt is probably true (as per bjsalba) that no-one could have stopped us.
But it still gives power and influence, power and influence I want to see destroyed, to the City of London. This entire country has been corrupted by a Tory Government and The City. Your previous articles about poverty do not resonate with either Tories or The City. They do resonate with your readership.
I want nothing to do with them.
I think that - come independece - our decent financial institutions will stick with us, and hell mend the rest!
I agree, Douglas.
DeleteUse of sterling seems to me a short term thing... as it was with all of the larger countries listed above by Anon.
The Euro is a non starter, I'd think. At l;east with the public, and definitely while some of the countries (who shouldn't have been in the € in the first place are in such a mess).
So we need a Scottish... something... Krona? Dollar? Whatever.
I favour the "Crown". It ties in with the Scandinavian Kroner/Krona and chimes with Scotland's history and current status as a kingdom. Even if we become a republic, there would be no need to change it.
DeleteMe Bungo Pony
Extra 'e' in independence, sorry about that....
ReplyDeleteErm, don't you mean a missing 'n'?
DeleteAt least you can spell the word correctly, unlike those who insist on spelling it "independance"....
zog
Yes but, I'll be doing an independance; on the day of independence.
DeleteDon't worry about little typos Douglas. It's not the end of the world.
DeleteHe he Jim... Munguin and I too...
tris and the other currency deniers saddos
ReplyDeleteOh dear the snp wanted to have more than favorable terms
when using the Queens pound if ( YA Didn't ) they had won
a referendum organised and run by the snp which they still
lost massively.
meanwhile as the Union supporters bend over backwards to
carry out the snp demands . the snp spit venom and hate towards
the Union and its supporters of which was proven to be a majority
of Scots.
and for not being allowed use of a pound sterling
a nation was lost
well that is wot the nats want to believe the truth
is somewhat more complex still heigh ho ! Leave them
to their delusions
And you to yours Niko, if you think Westminster gives a bawbee about you, me or anyone else outside of the M25.
DeleteNiko: Whatever you say.
DeleteNiko-"lost massively?" 5% is hardly a massive win. That was all that was needed to make it 50/50. You won't be so lucky next time round.
DeleteActually Nikos, the majority of "Scots" (those of us actually born here) voted YES in the referendum. "Scots" under 65y/o voted quite decisively YES.
DeleteThree groups voted overwhelmingly NO; the elderly, the English and EU nationals. The elderly voted NO largely because they were lied to about pensions; the English voted NO because they understandably wanted the status quo; EU nationals voted NO largely because they were lied to about EU membership guarantees.
Better Together cleverly concentrated on scaring the bejesus out of these minorities knowing full well the truth was not their friend. So they lied to them. Does it make you proud?
Me Bungo Pony
The Irish Free State, having fought a violent conflict to leave the British Empire was allowed to use Sterling. So why shouldn't we after having a democratic vote?
ReplyDeleteThe Unionists got the result they wanted but only through threats and intimidation. They think we have lost, we have not lost. The Union is dying.
Maybe Brits only understand violence and struggle.
DeleteWhen it comes to democracy there's a bit of a want about them.
Not available in "my Country"
ReplyDeletebugger!