Which ever it was, this is not what they get paid for. This Defence Review is an incredibly important part of their job, it's not like it was a discussion on a bypass for Hereford. They should have been on that bench. It was almost like there was no official opposition party there.
Of course, it could be said that as most of them probably agree with Cameron rather than their own leader, that we should spend money on bombs rather than bairns, there wouldn't have been an opposition party there anyway. So upon reflection they were probably as well washing their hair or getting pissed.
Quite clearly most of them don't support Corbyn on almost anything, but I wonder if they can see what asses they are making of themselves and how they are pulling their party apart.
Given that nearly 60% of the membership voted for Corbyn as leader, I'm seriously surprised that they cannot see that this membership...ie the people who vote for them; the people who canvas for them; the people who deliver leaflets, man the phones, etc, etc, want Corbyn to succeed.
I wonder how many of them got 60% of the vote in their constituencies.
They'd better start shaping up, or they may find themselves with no one to canvas for them at the next election.
Someone should remind them too, how much good it did Slab, siding with the Tories during the referendum. They should go ask one of the Scottish Labour MPs... Oh... yeah, I forgot... well, you know what I mean.
I see several options here: a) PLP to toe the line (fat chance); b) PLP to get rid of Corbyn, which is political suicide in the next GE; or c) Corbyn to get rid of the PLP, which I think is the least problematic option.
ReplyDeletePersonally I don't think that inclusive left-right wing bullshit for one bit. Corbyn must yank Labour to hard left (a very liberal interpretation in England) in order to win. Kicking and screaming if necessary. If not Labour will definitely at the very lose the North. Last GE was a warning sign that UKIP (spit) will gain the North if Labour is not careful.
He should lay ground for deselecting MPs who are against him. Especially that Danzcuk (spit again). A divided party will never win any election. I mean for god sake it is the Tories. Grievance alone could win Labour the election in 2020.
Labour must differentiate itself from Tories. There is a reason in Scotland they are know as Red Tories. It must stand for something. In this context it has to be hard left. Corbyn proved it was possible. Now he has to implement his ideas. The members are behind him anyways. He can afford to lose his Blairite MPs. If they want to jump ship so be it. Let's see whether they will survive a left-leaning Labour membership in the next election.
As for Scotland, to quote one Winger, we will be done in (20)21. All the best to the English.
Well, I certainly agree that he has to do something with them. They look like a rabble of two or three parties with very little in common.
DeleteIf we are to be stuck in this god forsaken union, then I'd like to think that the opposition might one day be able to form a government, but there seems to be no real opposition apart from the SNP/Green/Plaid people. At the moment Labour, split like this, would have no chance.
I see your three choices and I think I agree with your conclusion.
I'm pretty sure that some of them will end up- being de-selected, not by him but by their constituency parties.
I did notice you were doing a lot of spitting. So unlike the beautiful manners i remember that you have!!!! :)
When we met (lovely lovely Dundee), the Tories weren't in full-bastardly mode. I simply cannot believe the brazenness of them lot. Scots must be spitting left and right now. I mean I know all of these are to be expected, but so soon? What is the point of Scotland being in the Union?
DeleteCoupled with Labour being Labour...I am very surprised that they cannot see the problem. Corbyn IS the solution. There is no other way round. If the PLP cannot see this then Corbyn must take action. He needs to be ruthless. He is now a leader no longer a backbencher.
believe* that
ReplyDeleteknown* as
Goddamn Apple autocorrect
As you say.... :)
DeleteTris
ReplyDeleteI actually watched some of it and Corbyn was not too bad to be fair, Robertson was good but Scots are so looked down upon now in Westminster we might as well not have any reps, it's even worse than it was before. Cameron just tells lies, pure and simple. Jobs will go on the Clyde and defence is being consolidated in the South of England in the main. Every promise made has been broken or mostly broken, the Tories know that the media won't report it or will somehow turn it into the SNP's fault and Labour won't say a thing about any cuts in Scotland. Labour are finished, I will be surprised if they ever get over 30% again in Scotland. The empty benches across the board says it all, the SNP were well represented but that was about it in the main from what I saw. Labour are a disgrace and if I were a member I would be pushing for a lot of deselections I can tell you.
The Tories are scum and people better get ready for a wealth of new cuts in Scotland on top of the ones already on the way given Osbourne has to pay for the new jets and tanks and bombs plus they are going to give the English NHS around 6 billion but this is not investment it's structural or something so won't come under Barnett so Scotland will receive no uplift.
The SNP have got to reject the Scotland Bill no matter how much grief they get from the media, Scotland is being led down a very dangerous path and again sadly not being reported. I was working with a guy last night that blames every cut on the SNP, jobs are going because of the Council Tax freeze, where is the oil money now blah blah blah. The kind of ignorance that the Tories, Liberals and Labour love, what a country.
Bruce
I thought he was fair enough, if a little rambling, but he made some good points.
DeleteI notice that the Daily Telegraph's so-called Scottish edition announced as good news that the ships were to be built on the Clyde. Of course I didn't read any more than the headline, but there seemed little fuss being made about the job losses.
The financial statement this week should bring nothing but misery.
I'm inclined to believe you're right. The government should say no. They are not alone in thinking that this is a pig in a poke. The great English institution of the HoL has worked that out too.
I wonder why the Commons, particularly the opposition (other than the SNP) couldn't see that? I mean, did Union Jacket not look at the figures and realise what a mess they were handing us? I excuse Carmichael, him being rather taken up with being a criminal at the moment!
I mean for goodness sake, if it took a pile of over privileged aristocrats to notice, what are we paying the Commoners for?
Your mate who blamed the SNP for job losses because of council tax freeze, is of course right to an extent. if we had allowed the tax to go up and up, there would have been some more money for jobs. Not a lot, because the government made up most of what they lost.
But councils are at liberty to put up council tax if they want to. They would lose the extra money that Edinburgh gives them, but they can put the tax up by whatever amount they want.
Nice to see that the Brits manage to get around the Barnet Formula. Squeeze our NHS till it's as much of a dogs dinner as theirs?
You're right.
What a country.
This is my current beef with SNP leadership. I think they are being way too cautious with Westminster. I have a feeling this is principally due to Scots election next year. Obviously the shortest route to independence is gone. What I think they should do is create havoc within the UK Parliament in any possible way. I even think we should have peers in the Lords. If no SNP members want to be in the Lords, appoint Plaid to represent us there. Killing two birds with one stone.
DeleteIf they want us in the Union, they'd better be serious. If not SNP should got all out to frustrate the mechanics of Westminster until they beg us to leave.
We must remember we are now in the Union for the short haul. We are should not/no longer bound by our longstanding fairplay rule. Our end objective is to hasten the end of this Union, nothing else.
Will you believe this Abu, I do not know how but I was just going to ask Tris if he had heard from you and there you were. So nice to hear your take on things again.
ReplyDeleteWe are badly served by the Labour Party as party of opposition, we they certainly do not oppose, more like lie down and get walked on, or they serve our imperial masters.
Jeremy may well be a good MP but sorry I just do not see him as a leader and that is not a good thing. The fact that not many of those who are supposed to work with him do either is a handicap. I fear the Labour Membership have another pup, or they bought another failure. I have yet to see Labour with the right person at the top. Miliband was useless, and I am not going into the litany of failures here in Scotland.
Scotland is to become a wasteland so when it's eventual Independence happens, it will have to claw it's way back. We are competitors, Scotland and England, and like the US and Cuba, there can only be one successful state. I leave it to you to make up your mind which it is to be.
It's hard, Helena.
DeleteCorbyn is hugely popular with the membership and although I don;t agree with all he says, he has some good ideas.
I love the way that he will not be brought down by Cameron, and every time that Cameron tries a smart arse approach with him he just makes himself look small.
But he's not leading. He's being pushed about by the wily right wing Blairite faction that want to run with world with the Obamas/Xi/Hollandes of this world.
AH is right. It's time he got a grip.
I gave time to allow Corbyn to tell us who he is and what he stands for. He is certainly committed to his beliefs, and for that he deserves respect. But the man is no leader and his reaction to the Paris shootings were led by his heart, not his head. As a major political leader, you must be pragmatic. You are not going to get everything you want, and you, as a politician, represent every constituent regardless of their political leanings. His biggest faux pas was the appointments of Angela Eagle and Ken Livingston to the defence review. Makes the referendum campaigners (both sides) seem docile in comparison! I don't think it's from lack of effort on his part. His approach to PMQ's I like.
Delete. I see him better placed in a sort of Margo MacDonald role - independent of party politics but to be a voice of reason. Although he is not even close to the strong politician she was. While I've never agreed with all of her policies (who does?) rate her as one of the strongest Scottish politician of recent times.
zog
It is very nice of you to remember me (blush). Rest assured I was just very busy. However I read my Scottish blogs religiously. Comments too.
DeleteI have to disagree on this point. Corbyn is exactly what England need. The problem is Corbyn hasn't fully realised this. Yet. Once he does, I think he will put serious effort of being a PM. Right now he is just opposing. Though in some other blogs, it was said he is letting the Blairites dig their own graves.
Worth noting also, there was a substantial number of Labour members that left the party when Corbyn was elected. It was assumed those were the pro Blairites. Labour is now turning leftwards. I hope those new members have the patience before Corbyn starts the purging.
I rather have him as PM when Scotland becomes independent. Imagine having to negotiate with May, Boris or Osborne (shudders).
I would worry too much about Scotland. Just remember Common Weal's motto: ALL OF US FIRST. We'd be alright no matter what.
wouldn't*
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DeleteThose Labour MPs who support Bomber Cameron may well appease the Daily Mail reading section of their electorate but will be remembered after the dust has settled as those who enabled the British state to attack yet another Muslim country.
ReplyDeleteBy the time Cameron has left the stage there may not be a country in the Middle East he hasn't attacked (perhaps excluding Israel).
The "ethical" foreign policy that Robin Cook tried to implement lasted all of about 10 minutes with an establishment steeped in the virtues of "Do unto others before they do unto you".
Those Labour MPs would do well to remember that Bomber Cameron doesn't care who he attacks so long as he is seen as an important international player (like Putin).
Who's next after Syria?
My question would be.... given the mess they left behind in Iraq, Afghanistan and Libya, what kind of mess do people reckon they will leave behind in Syria?
DeleteHow will Russia and the USA deal with the aftermath.
What will Saudi have to say about it?
How will Cameron cope with all the different international pressures from important people that he wants to be friends with?
http://ukpollingreport.co.uk/blog/archives/9553?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+PollingReport+%28UK+Polling+Report%29
DeleteIn the sidebar... UK Polling Report, Yougov poll on Corbyn.
Interesting comments too.
One person asks: What would happen if most of the shadow cabinet resigned?
If the shadow cabinet resigns, appoint other Labour MPs. Some are more pliant than others. Like I said in the above, this broad tent issue is bullshit. In politics always appoint your allies.
DeleteCorbyn needs to appeal to the electorate, not the PLP. I think he has the moral high ground here. 30+ Labour MPs opposing Tories all the time is better and more credible than having a feeble 200 poor imitation of Tories ones.