This blog supports Scottish Independence. Comments on it, and contents of linked blogs, do not necessarily reflect Munguin's opinions.
The Scots are either the stupidest folk on earth, or the most cowardly. Maybe a mixture of both, but we are certainly the most cowed and brainwashed.Scotland the Brave my arse.
Pretty much beginning to agree. How could they have believed anything that BT said. I admit that I disbelieved most of it, but even I never thought that it would be this bad.
Pretty much beginning to agree. How could they have believed anything that BT said.Tris- i actually dont think that "anything that bt said" swayed more than a very very few Scots into voting no.I believe most of the 55% have never given the "actuality" of Scotland as an independent entity much thought. I believe the "dumbing down" always has been a unionist policy from the word go. And it SHOWS!God help poor auld Scotia...
Although there are people who just completely refuse to consider Scotland as a country and see Britain as their land and London as their capital... and presumably Edinburgh as a regional "capital" with the local council, I do believe that if there had been an unbiased and balanced discussion, without the hatred that dripped from every pore of the Slab lot (more so than the Tories really), the vilification of the SNP (Nazis) and Alex Salmond himself, the complete refusal to contemplate that the socialist and Greens and much of Labour itself was behind independence... and the lies told by the BBC, which supported the myth that Scotland was just a super-county of England, we would have been negotiating our settlement now.People were coming round. From around 25% at the beginning of the debate, to over 50%.Then of course we got their vow. Their solemn promise that there would be a federal settlement... and enough of them went back to the imperial government side. Enough of them believed that SPIVs like Cameron, Brown, Clegg and Miliband were honourable Englishmen who would keep their word.Yes, I begin to think of these people as idiots. Imagine believing anything these Tory creeps said...
I sometimes wonder why I still fight but fight I must, I cannot get out of this benighted country. We have to say Juteman that no other has what we have, no newspapers, no control of Broadcasting. We also have a good few of those who earned their seed corn in the South and then we have the middle class. Those who did vote for Independence were in fact those with little to lose, they hopefully saw that there might be benefits to being out of the Union, and I do not mean welfare. Many were young families who see the YooKay was not working for them and for their children. The ones we did not reach were those, like the couple I met on Holiday a couple of years ago, "We are not for Independence" I consider them to be the stupid, the elderly did what they were told, brought up in a day when a good serf did that.
Maybe next time they will remember what a pack of liars the UK government and opposition presents.
If you can't be proud of your country, be DAMNED proud of your city!
Or just be damned.
But I should say that I am proud of Dundee... Not only did we show the way in the referendum, but the work that is being done on the town centre is fantastic.
Having been in Dundee last week, at the Caird Hall for Nicola's speech, I have to admit that Dundee is looking braw. Any chance you could annex Perth, pleeeeeeease?
I missed you, PB... I was there with Munguin and Mum.Yes, it's looking good. And the waterfront is starting to take a little bit of shape.It's quite exciting to have the place remodelled.Dunno about getting Perth on board...all you need is a good council.
I think the wee mouse that daunert in tae the vets, hud mair baws than the Scots electorate. But then again it widnae hud been watchin the beeb and readin pish fae the Daily Rectum etal.
Lucky wee mouse... that's what I say. :)
TrisI think you will find, among no voters, a real mix. Some will have believed the lies so the Clyde issue, the impending budget cuts, the failure to deliver any real meaningful change will come to them as a betrayal and a shock, but with little opportunity to fight against it other than an SNP vote in next years GE.There will be those who knew exactly what they were voting for because they are British first and Scottish never or last, and there will be those who don't care. Most of the rest of us will not be surprised, most of us who followed the debate and learned more about how politics works in the UK knew what was coming in the event of a no vote and warned people as best we could. I don't feel any satisfaction that the 45% were right, I just feel a sense of resignation and pity for all of us who will suffer because of what will always have been the wrong choice. I also have no faith in the Smith Commission, I haven't from the start, I watched a little this morning getting shown live and was even more depressed so switched it off. They started with discussing equality, a very important topic which I accept, but not the most pressing one to start these very limited dicussions with within such a tight time frame. I would think that social security, taxation and where Scotland sits within the nonsence of a non written constitution are more pressing topics. I suspect that the Smith Commission will concentrate on fluff, no matter how important, like health and safety etc and spend too much time on it to allow no debate on the issues that really matter to Scotland and it's ability to bring about real change. I also suspect that submissions by members of the public will generally be ignored, Rev Stew is right about that one. So overall not hopeful at all in this area.The only thing that I can see that will be really interesting will be Conservative back benchers voting against any devolution without EVEL, and Labours refusal to even engage with hague's committee because they know that they are looking at the wilderness for years to come if they vote with the Tories. However, I suspect that Labour are looking at the wilderness anyway, esp if the Clyde issue goes the wrong way, which it might ,but I suspect they will reach a half way house agreement somewhere that will let them at least argue some ships will be built but nothing like enough to sustain 11,000 jobs across the whole sector. I also think that the Tories will happily have say 40 SNP MPs in the house because they genuingly believe that the independence issue has been put to bed. If enough Scottish voters get angry enough in the next couple of years that will need to be put to the test with another referendum called in Holyrood with or without Westminster approval and lets see where the cards fall, Scotland is not Catalonia.Interesting if somewhat scary and sad times. Things are going to get worse, the question is do we as a people have the balls to stand up and say no way and just get the f out of this unholy elitest one sided union.Bruce
Like you Bruce, I never had any faith in the Smith Commission.To look at something like devo-max/federalism in a few months was an impossible task, even if they could hope to be fair.But I have always maintained that if we give them the chance to make good their promises and they fail, then we go at the next stage from a position of high moral ground.OK. We lost because you made a vow; then instead of the actual vow you set up a commission with targets and timetables. This failed to reach any conclusions.. and even those will be thwarted by the English dominated parliament whose members are, quite understandably, fed up to the back teeth of talking about a little country in the north about which they know little and care less.I doubt that the SNP will have 40 seats. Who knows what Labour and the Tories will cook up to avoid that situation. We know that when they want to they work nicely together to thwart Scotland.We may get 20, which will annoy them. Maybe it will cost Ed Miliband number 10. We may be able to swing some concession. Don't get me wrong, I'd love them to have 59 seats. I just don't think it will happen.But I think it is very interesting... and I wonder how far they can push us before we start to lose the rag!
My daughter works with some 'posh' folk in Embra. She has told me that some of them are feeling ashamed at voting No.It's coming.
So they should.Yeah...I know its coming.
I never had faith in the 'vow' because the leading two proponents of 'Better Together' were two back bench Labour MPs both talking of standing down at the next election. They had no mandate to speak for the Westminster Government and nothing they said was binding, that also applies to the Daily Record. The Westminster Government could let AD and GB say what they wanted and then wash there hands of all of it after the event. They hinted they would punish Scotland for the impertinence and here it comes. I just hope (though I suspect not) that those who voted No get the worst of this,
Well Anon, I think they only postponed the day of independence.You see, I reckon that they don;t care a stuff for Britain, what they care about is THEM.Cameron hopes that it will be another prime minister who has to deal with the loss of Scotland (and its money).I suppose Gordon and Alistair just want their aristocratic titles.You'd think that the way that people laugh at their silly names, idiotic dress and ridiculous comic opera customs, they would be ashamed to be seen there... and of course if they were real Labour people they wouldn't be seen within a mile of the House of peers... but what the hell.
The day a Labour person accepted a peerage started their decline.At least the SNP refuses to join the establishment house of lackeys.The man o' independent mind He looks an' laughs at a' that.
You know the one thing I just cannot get my head around is that people said they did not trust Politicians but THEY trusted Politicians, and ones who had as you said no power to actually deliver. I would have to agree with you about taking peerages, they were bought so cheaply were they not.I remember Madame Ecosse suggesting accepting and was howled down. All rebels have to remember what they are fighting, the Establishment and they stretch right round the world these days. They will fight like rats in a trap to keep the advantage they hold over the plebs.
Tpotally agree Juteman.I could understand it, I suppose way back when the House of Lords had huge amounts of power. They needed to have someone in there.However, Labour should have neutered the HoL and then abolished it and taken all the titles away from the idiots who were flattered to take them.I just can;t imagine that anyone would be anything else rather than ashamed to introduce themselves as Lord So and So, or Baron Such and Such.It's restoration comedy to me...I sincerely hope no one from the SNP ever takes a seat in the HoL Helena.It would be a betrayal.
Cameron hopes that it will be another prime minister who has to deal with the loss of Scotland (and its money).No Tris- they dont give a toss about "scotland" Its only its money they care aboot.....
Well, I really meant the embarrassment... You know, like the George that lost America.Of course I agree that they don;t give a stuff about Scotland. They only care about themselves and their "legacy".Talking of which I seem to recall that within weeks of getting the job, Cameron was talking about the Big Society as his legacy.I wonder how that's working out?